TE50 vs VX GTS

[kohan]

As a holden man i have to say my god this looks good


isnt it funny, the AU looks so awkward and awful, but in TE50 form it looks sensational. If they werent selling for so much i would consider buying one, actually until i saw the interior dashboard, oh well i still think its a fantastic car, but for that money i couldnt go past the best looking HSV ever, the VX GTS.

I reckon that was the best ever modern time for fast aussie cars. VX GTS versus the TE50. They were just so good looking. What do you guys think?

[GCRXR6]

Should have taken the TE50 ... the VX loves to spread it's legs and scrub away your valueable rubber.

[Redwight]

Actually for the dollars I'd go the TS50 and buy a supercharger, nearly as indulgent as a bucket of KFC; and just as bad for your health.

[jPod]

TE50. Aged better (although, imo, non-hsv VX's remain the best looking Holden ever made, I hate the axe-murderer grille on the HSV's though - especially when fitted to a VS...), has a nicer interior (imo, the VT, VX interior is dated and cheap, while the AU interior isn't the best, but nicer than VT/VX), and has that sweeeeeet engine... the 5.7 GenIII was a bit of a lump once it had a few kays on it... the Windsor pushes hard its whole life, and the dynamics. The AU had a nice stiff chassis, semi-competent IRS (in sports tune) and good weight distribution, while the VX ran that awful Opel Omega chassis...

There is a reason the TE50 still costs more...

[trainman]

TE50 all the way. It may cost more, but then again quality costs!

Personally I've thought that all HSV's have been fugly for tha last 15years at least! Made even worse by being built on a half arsed chassis and suspension set up. Ford may have taken their sweet time building a true performance Falcon, but when they did they got the chassis sorted, and had a body strong enough to tie it all together. Having said that, with time and money you can build some pretty awesome E's.

[Dr. Miracle]

actually until i saw the interior dashboard

yep, the au dash was a letdown imo. the BA XT dash looked better.

ofcorse i would have bought the T series i just love them so much.

[Perun]

T series, of course. It was maybe a little bit slower than a GTS at the time but my God those things are fun to drive!

[kohan]

wow, even though this is on a ford forum im surprised you guys gave the gts nothing. i remember about a year back on this website, i posted a thread "list of 20 cars you would love to have in your garage" and i would say most people included the vx gts.

i personally think its the best looking HSV sedan- one guy was right looks like an axe murderer designed it with all its sharp edges, i reckon if batman owned an aussie car the vx gts would be it.

and best looking fte/fpv looks like a v8 supercar only a lot better.
Is there anyone that agrees with me?
performance: easily goes to gts. 0-400m vx 13.3secs te50 14.8secs

interior: vx wins hands down against the te50/ford taurus dashboard

However both are so desirable, only a fricken moron would sell them, because they already own the best. I think the gts is definently the better car but the te50 is so damn hot aswell. They will both be classics

[Redwight]

Dont be all that suprised, while they are great cars, the blue teams preference should be a given. And seriously turbo nick's got the magic factor covered here; take them both for a drive and I will alway go back to the Tickford car. Adding a few performance accessories will get even more acceleration anytime but if the car doesn't put a smile on your face then don't bother with it.

[kohan]

you could add performance mods to either car to make it better.
But the performance doesnt really bother me, i just dont think i sit sit in the car with that interior without feeling sick. Is it easy to intall ba interior? because the ba interior is really good

[Tiffla]

Kohan, mate dont bother on this site... I not bias on ford or holden, i like both really. But ford au have NOTHING over the gts vx, power and looks, what about the interior on the vx? (someone said "VX interior is dated and cheap") I bet they've never ever sat in one before in their life... Anyway, whenever i look at a thread that involves holden, straight away its the same people who come and bag it out lol. Like how they say that the 5.4 v8 boss motor is great and better then holdens 6L? Who are they kidding? Big deal 315kw, i know engine tuners that a pulling 450rwhp out of 6L commo's with a cam change exhaust and dyno tune. You tell me what your 5.4L is going to do? I know a guy who spent thousands at c n v perfomance on his ford GT 5.4L, cam change exhaust tune, and he's making 280rwkw or something...
So now whenever i read about holden on this forum, i just let it go over my head because its hopeless really. I know a fair few holden fans and they never bag out ford as bad as what people do on this forum ay. Kind of makes me hate ford whenever i read those threads.

[kohan]

yeh your right, i am a holden man but i reckon the car in the country under $100,000 is the fg typhoon, and all the fg and ba's are great cars too. Im happy to admit that. during the 80's and 90's anything from ford, while well made, was boring. there were exceptions xr8's and eb and el GT's and obviously the TE50. Anyway why are we bagging out these great cars, when the most boring car company on the planet is easily outselling both holden and ford. When was the last time toyota made a real good car? About 25 years ago i reckon. Too many people out there with no clue about cars so they just get a toyota. like people with no clue about computers so they just go to harvey norman and get sold pieces of garbage. Yeh i know its off topic but i was on a rant

Every time i see the TE50 and VX GTS i just stare at them like a perv.
If i had a load of cash i would not hesitate in buying both of them

[AdamzXRUte]

I have most Wheels and Motor mags from 1999 to now, and you will not find a comparo that said the HSV out handled the Tickfords. Not one. You will also not find a comparo that said the Ford wouldn't be the better everyday car to live with. So no, we are not biased, just state the facts. I have driven VT's and VX's and the interior have aged poorly and were poor quality from the start. The AU is a matter of personal taste, I happen to own one and am very happy with it.

Holden's and HSV's may be quicker in a straight line, but take it down the Ocean Road, the XR6, XR8, TE, and TS will beat their Holden and HSV counterpart. I leave out TL and Grange because it's not what they're for. That's not being biased, just stating the facts.

[ELSpeedo]

A Handbuilt Australian 5.6 347 stroker Windsor. That says enough for me.
Street Machine call it one of the best motors ever to come out of Australia.
Faster than a stock BA GT and it has a very unique look about it as well.

Redright let him get used to the car. I don't want another post in
the your ride section for- 'got a supercharger- car made love to
a telegraph pole' It should be plenty fast for him get a few
speeding tickets.

Ignore the BS magazines they often cannot get a V8 off the mark,
the TS50 I drove was good for 5.5 seconds- running on 98 octane-
no tuning at all. The auto's can have a mod chip on them to
get under 6 seconds. But after 140kmph........

Yes the dashboard is not to everybodies taste but Im no arts student either.
Im only interested in power, handling and braking everything else comes second.

[AL NZ]

well, well, Sunday afternoon in the cul-de-sac and what do I see?
It was a bit like that great scene from "The Castle"...

The neighbour was moving the VN GTS and the VX SS to get out his Toyota van (spot the odd one out), while the other neighbour's mate was dropping in in his VERY nice metallic navy blue TE50 with very smart chrome Simmons-style wheels (like those 80s BBS wheels with large spokes like a wire wheel). Of those three, it is the TE that I prefer. Sounds good too.
And at 250kW that's about 336.47bhp. Makes me wonder, what hp did the GT351 HO actually, really, honestly have in its time? I have heard 380bhp bandied about, but I take that with a grain of NaCl.
Meanwhile, the other other neighbour was grinding rust from the chassis of his V8 Pilot on the lawn, while I washed the humble BA in the driveway.

All I needed was Kath and Kim to pop up and ask for a ride to Fountaincourt...

[xlr8_22]

You're right kohan, both cars have their good and bad points. I'd like to think of them as the first stage of the modern muscle car battle between holden and ford. Up until the T3, Tickfords own cars were AU fairmonts with coloured in bumpers and a tickford badge (and around 200kw), it was XR's or nothing if you wanted a ford muscle car (ive seen maybe four T1 and T2 tickfords in the last year). Meanwhile the VT hsv range had around 215-220kw, not sure though, and the same lights as standard commodores, and a GTS 300kw (limited edition?).

Along comes the T3 TE50 and GTS, the T3 was a major change for ford fans, with its hand built stroked windsor and a head turning, race style bodykit. then you've got the GTS, chunky, in your face bodykit and a power premium over the Clubsport. then with the release of the BA, ford is looking to one-up holden/ HSV, and the 290kw GT is released and Tickford is turned into FPV, hsv counters with the 260kw VY clubsport line up.

each model change sees each side move its ranges further away from the Ford/ Holden performance models. Enter XR6T/ Typhoon, and a new hero car emerges,
Nowadays you get lots of choices for new FPV/HSV muscle cars, turbo six, V8, quad cam or pushrod, six speed auto or manual, sedan, wagon or ute. I like to think the TE50 and VX GTS started the one upmanship that got us the current crop of FPV's and HSV's.

[kohan]

im glad people are starting to see my point that both cars are drool worthy. The thing i dont understand is how you can defend au interior, it is probably the worst interior i have ever seen besides ford taurus. (however i do admit i havnt seen fte interior but have been in futuura's etc, but i have seen photos), but it looks even worse than my 92 magna sitting in a heap at my parents house. As for holden the interior it has aged really well, my vt has 489,000kms on it and still looks great on the inside with only the slightest of rattles/noise you dont notice it unless you really listen. Isat in a couple of vt hsv's yesterday and they looked great on the inside. I think the windsor would be fantastic, it might be a bit slower than gts but who cares, its still a weapon and have heard they sound great.

[AL NZ]

back to Fountaincourt - here is a pic - spot the TE50...

[trainman]

...what about the interior on the vx? (someone said "VX interior is dated and cheap") I bet they've never ever sat in one before in their life...

The thing i dont understand is how you can defend au interior, it is probably the worst interior i have ever seen besides ford taurus...
As for holden the interior it has aged really well, my vt has 489,000kms on it and still looks great on the inside with only the slightest of rattles/noise you dont notice it unless you really listen.

My main gripe with Holden interiors is how dated they are to begin with. It generally takes them 5-10 years to catch up with modern trends, and when they do it still feels cheap and nasty compared to the competition. And even then for the size of the cars, the interiors are cramped and annoying. I'm 6'1", and have large legs. Most commodore's I find myself sitting with one of my knee's pressed into the dashboard, and with the lack of steering reach adjust, it's either cram both my knee's into the dash, or not have a good grip on the steering. Poor packaging, poor design, and poor presentation. Hallmarks of the Commodore.

Sounds like you got a good VT there. My experience tells me that the Holden interiors are usually pretty poorly assembled. Roof linings sag, plastics discolour easily, and other minor annoyances. My ED hasn't been touched inside, I have one rattle which I suspect is because I need to do the door rubbers, the plastics look like they came from Ford yesterday, the only real degradation has been the rear headrests (the leather has dried out and the stitching has split), and the steering wheel (typical leather wheel wear and sun damage).

The AU dashboard while unconventional, isn't all that bad. It's thankfully not as severe as the Taurus dashboard, which was just abysmal, but I do understand how people don't like it. I personally prefer it due to the huge amount of leg room it affords in the front. Again not a favourite of mine, but the interior is much better designed for it's purpose, remember all that changed for the bench seat was removal of the centre console.

And yes, I have been in both, and even find that the Fords have a somewhat "Hard" feel about them now days.

...Anyway why are we bagging out these great cars, when the most boring car company on the planet is easily outselling both holden and ford. When was the last time toyota made a real good car? About 25 years ago i reckon.

By my reckoning it's been 16 years. The ST185 Celica in GT4 was the last truly serious car from Toyota. That was when Toyota still cared about WRC victory.

back to Fountaincourt - here is a pic - spot the TE50...

Gah! That fugly ute is in the way!

[Perun]

Having driven everything from base model Fortes to TS50s, and Executives to Statesmen and HSVs, interior finish goes to Ford, hands down. Give it a few years and the Holden dash will have more squeaks in it than a 5yo cab's suspension. The dash itself didn't look too bad but it didn't age well. My 3yo XR is still yet to drop a piece of trim or develop a squeak.

As for 5.4L Windsor strokers... once they loosened up, stock TEs have recorded 1/4 mile times as low as mid 13s. It's a well know (although unofficial) fact that the 5.4L DID NOT have only 250kw. I recall watching a brand new TE50 (3000km on the odo) with a 4sp auto being run on the dyno and pumping out 206rwkw.

I pay respect where respect is due, but the VT-VZ Commodores were underengineered and poorly built. They had major issues with the V8s, crap 4sp gearboxes, woeful IRS... All they had going for them was that they were tarted up to look more presentable to the general public than the AU.

[jPod]

Kohan, mate dont bother on this site... I not bias on ford or holden, i like both really. But ford au have NOTHING over the gts vx, power and looks, what about the interior on the vx? (someone said "VX interior is dated and cheap") I bet they've never ever sat in one before in their life... Anyway, whenever i look at a thread that involves holden, straight away its the same people who come and bag it out lol. Like how they say that the 5.4 v8 boss motor is great and better then holdens 6L? Who are they kidding? Big deal 315kw, i know engine tuners that a pulling 450rwhp out of 6L commo's with a cam change exhaust and dyno tune. You tell me what your 5.4L is going to do? I know a guy who spent thousands at c n v perfomance on his ford GT 5.4L, cam change exhaust tune, and he's making 280rwkw or something...
So now whenever i read about holden on this forum, i just let it go over my head because its hopeless really. I know a fair few holden fans and they never bag out ford as bad as what people do on this forum ay. Kind of makes me hate ford whenever i read those threads.

ooooh boy... you got me started.

a) I was in a VX for about 6 hours the week they were released. One of my best mates dad works for Holden, and we went for a road trip. At the time my dad had an AUII Forte company car, and even my mates dad had to admit, the black interior in that was nicer than the Holdens. The interior is cheap and dated.

b) the 315Kw Boss has more peak power and torque across the rev range when dyno tested vs the HSV 6.2L and doesn't suffer from heatsoak like the HSV does (as shown in a wheels mag. If wheels gives credit to a Ford, it HAS to be true, because usually they just make rubbish up to make the Holden look better).

c) If your friend spent thousands to only get 280rwkw out of a boss, then either he doesn't know what he is doing or the guy he paid doesn't. Rob Herrod can get well over 300rwkw out of one with nothing but a cam and a flash tuner... then he has fun and supercharges it to well and truly over 400.

d) If you think that Holden fans don't bag out Fords badly, then clearly you do not know many Holden fans... I have been told everything that is holy and s**t by Holden fans, most of which make me tear at the eyes with laughter

e) The VX was a nice looking car externally, still imo, the best looking Commodore made, but the HSV, like all HSV's were haphazardly designed and fugly, while sitting on their pathetic chassis

f) The GENIII failed the test of time, most at only 3000Km's... and while can be made to do amazing things with the right mods, they can never "piss on" the Windsor, which in 5.0 form was able to keep up with most 5.7 tune Holdens. The windsor btw, has shown with time that with more than 200,000Km on the clock still pushes as hard as out of the showroom, if not harder. I was in a VY (now THERE is another fail interior) GENIII SS once (not the greatest of occasions, it was in a funeral procession for my wifes late father, it was a distant uncle's car) and when given the beans, it felt like my EB could flog it. Took forever to get going, even the drivers brother sitting next to him started asking him if that is all it had.

Again, there is a reason why the TE50 is worth more than a VX GTS. Yes, out of the showroom, the extra 30kw odd made the Holden faster to 100 and in the quarter mile (The GTS was a 300kw yes?), but its looks, its soundtrack, its confusion at the concept of a "bend in the road", and its incredibly poor build quality made the Tickford a much better car. If you want 0-100 and quarter mile, buy a go kart and fit a motorbike engine to it. If you want a car that is well put together, safe, reliable, handles well, feels like a race car, and still quite fast, then get yourself a TE50.

[AL NZ]

you're up very early, jpod, or else very late to bed.

[jPod]

you're up very early, jpod, or else very late to bed.

Finished work at 2am... i'm up late...

[hamson_4]

l reckon all commodores from VT thru VZ are ugly.VR VS looked ok as does the VE.
But l think the T series looks sweeet
Oh and re:the AU interior,not bad quality,but pretty plain looking imo

[Wizards Sleeve]

This argument, like a school yard.

Spend and extra 5 grand and get an E36 3.2 litre M3, no-one is going to argue with that.

From someone who hasn't lived in Australia since those two were released and gives a rats either side the GTS looks better except the Pox taillights.

And with either one I would lament not being able to find a new F6 or an original VL Group 3/Group A pluspack...